Hi all, quick question. What Tamiya Acrylic is the same shade as the US Navy Dark Grey 5-D used for vertical surfaces on submarines during WWII

Thanks

Hi Dave.

I don't know if there is one. Let me dig out my Lifecolor paint sets, which may have the right color, and I will see if I can find a Tamiya equivalent.

US Navy Set One had the 5D color so I will go paint it on something and see how I go. Give me a little break from the cursed Akagi PE...

Cheers
Warren

Warren

Thanks. I appreciate it. Just out of curiosity how do you like the lifecolor paints? How are they compared to Tamiya?

Thanks

Dave

Hmmm.. They are very good for applying with hairy sticks. Great coverage etc. But for airbrushing I think my nozzle is a bit fine. Tends to clog up a bit. But I will be using then again soon and I will report back then, if I remember..

Hi Dave, I can't help with your Tamiya question as I don't use the stuff however Lifecolor is a 'True' acrylic being water based just like Revell Aquacolor, Vallejo and the old Pollyscale S and a few others. Being water based they dry fast hence if shot through an airbrush you need three things, low air pressure, paint the consistency of milk and a retarder otherwise the paint dries before it hits the surface and also on the tip of the airbrush, this is true for all water based acrylics.
Unlike Tamiya which is actually a lacquer, Lifecolor can be brush painted with no thinning or other prep except a primer coat which is required by all acrylics. All my ships are done with Lifecolor using a hairy stick.

Sorry to rant on a bit but it gets me when I read other threads were they say Lifecolor is rubbish and Tamiya is the best thing since sliced bread, the thing is they are two totally different types of paint one of which is wrongly labelled as an acrylic (Tamiya)

To try and answer your first question David, XF-17 (Sea Blue) would be the viable equivalency of the US Navy color 5D (Dark Grey)in Tamiya!

I have both Luciano, the problem with Lifecolor is that it is much harder to get here. I use it for some of my ships that need US Navy colours as no other company has the ones I normally need. I like Lifecolor so much I just ordered the 2 Western Approach sets from the UK for my up coming Corvette build.

Dave, I just painted the Lifecolor 622 on a piece of plastic, and right next to it I painted Tamiya XF-63 which looks to be a close match. When they are dry I will take a picture for you but don't hold your breath as today is cool and raining. The first day like it since last year!!

Very handy actually as I planted some plants yesterday and the rain will make sure they are even better watered in than a drenching with the hose.

Cheers
Warren

Erm.. not from what I can see Todd. Way too blue in my eyes.

Warren, The US 5D was Sea Blue ANA 607. This color was close to if not the same as the Dark Non-spectical blue even being labeled Dark Grey. Depending on the light would even appear to be almost black.

Cross referencing the ANA 607, Tamiya's Sea Blue XF-17 comes up from what I am seeing. If checked against a listing of IPMS Stockholm where they use FS/FS 595 numbers (Which didn't exist when the paint was created), two number show up...355042 & 35045, both extremely dark. Then there is Snyder and Short's 5D.

Tamiya


Snyder & Short



FS 35042



FS 35045



I would think the Snyder and Short listing would be the best reference, but the trouble with color research is unless you have the actual cards in front of us, we can only go by what we see on a monitor and we all know are about as reliable as someone trying to interpret what color is being viewed in a black and white photo...a good guess at best.

Gentlemen,

Thanks for all the responses. This is one of the reasons that I love this site. All the experience and willingness to share.

Luciano, thanks for the information regarding the Life Color paints. I will definitely keep that in mind. I have been using the Tamiya and to be honest I think that dries too fast so the Life Color is something I will have to get use to.

I never judge paint, they all have their pros and cons.

Warren and Todd, thanks for the recommendation. I will look at both. I will probably tone it down some cause the pictures of the Dace I have seen looks to be lighter grey than the dark grey appears to be. Could be just that it was sun bleached.

In either case, I have to order the paints since I don't have them to paint the verticals on the Dace.

thanks again everyone for the input.

Dave

No real direct Tamiya equivalent - sources elsewhere claim Vallejo Model Color 898 (cart.posit.48) Dark Sea Blue works.
Really dark grey with a blue cast. All WWII USN colors seemed to have some purple/blue in them. FS 35042 is supposed to be the Federal Standard - colors portrayed on computer monitors are always suspect, but have a look here - and remember the scale effect,

http://www.colorserver.net/showcolor.asp?fs=35042&bkgr=10

For the most part, color can be subjective. Tracy White has a tremedous amount of documentation on the subject of standard and camouflage paints on his Researcher at large site - http://www.researcheratlarge.com/ Snyder and Short is a great referencing to get colors close to what they might have been.

One of the biggest problems with paints and painting companies is the colors are derived from the FS number system for the most part. One company will put a little more white or a little bit more black and the color is different. There is no true color match. WEM seemed to be the closest, but being the company id dissolved and the growing trend to work with acrylics verses the solvents, all we can do is use records like Snyder and Short and supporting documentation from folks like Tracy to get a color that is close to what we might think is correct.

OK. Here are the results.

Lifecolor 5D is second from the left. Third from the left is Tamiya XF-63, German Grey. A pretty close match I think you will agree. The other color on the ends is XF-17. Not quite what the question was asking in the first place.

Cheers
Warren

I am thinking the pictures are missing?

From my understanding of the references, that I have read, 5D Dark Gray, was made from
Lamp Black pigments and a medium alkyd base, which when mixed, yielded a very dark black/gray
almost charcoal color.
You should not see any blue in it.



Cheers,
Joe

Joe, That would certainly support the Snyder and Short sampling of the color where it is basically a black shade. Judging form their research on the subject, I would think the color ranges from their two cards are the closest thing we might have to that actual colors.

Wondering if Tamiya XF85 Rubber Black or even XF69 Nato Black could do the job?

Cheers,
Joe

I am thinking they would work pretty well actually. And if someone felt the need to put that tinge of blue or even purple in there, a drop or two would work.

I am thinking you are 100% correct Todd. Blame my current trials with Franken-Akagi!



OK. Here are the results.

Lifecolor 5D is second from the left. Third from the left is Tamiya XF-63, German Grey. A pretty close match I think you will agree. The other color on the ends is XF-17. Not quite what the question was asking in the first place.

Cheers
Warren

Thanks for the impromptu color chart there Warren. Certainly show the differences between the colors.

I terms of Dave's question and the 5D coloring on vertical surfaces of subs though, the XF-17 still appears to be closer the the Navy 5D color where it is an almost Black color.

I am thinking the Life Color 5D is more of the 5-O/5-O Alternative Ocean Grey. Still an awesome coloring if you ask me! I have their two set on the list of must gets! Can never have enough options when it comes to paint!!

Warren thanks again for the assist and paint comparison. The Lifecolor sets are now on my list

Todd thanks for the information on the paint and US Navy philosophy on camo. I just thought paint was paint. Goes to show I still have much to learn

Well I'm in hold as I don't have either paints so I'll go back to doing some more research as I wait for their arrival

Thanks fellas

Dave

In the end, if the color looks good to you, that is all that really matters my friend! Looking forward to seeing the color fly!!

It's been an interesting thread and I think I've learned a thing or two as well.
Not wanting to hijack the thread, but what are peoples opinions on Lifecolor paints? I've been thinking of getting the Royal Navy and USN sets for my builds. The paint-as-you-build method works best for me when building ships, but I am finding it slowed down by waiting for Humbrol enamels to dry as well as trying to find the equivalents in their range. I find their acrylics a bit thick and gloopy out the pot, near transparent when thinned and still too small in choice. It looks like Lifecolor do all the paints I'd need for both navies while Tamiya has the IJN covered fairly well.

Thanks
Stephen