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General Ship Modeling
Discuss modeling techniques, experiences, and ship modeling in general.
Rui Wanted an Update
CarlOmaha
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Posted: Monday, October 26, 2009 - 08:28 AM UTC
This isn't a "Full Speed" example for the bow would be higher out of the water, but here is a higher speed wake than before. The Liquitex will have to dry and I'll add a little more to the bow and try to fold over the bow wave. Then some white paint will add a lot to this effect.







skipper
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Posted: Monday, October 26, 2009 - 09:12 AM UTC
Yeap, definitely, I like the raw result!

Rui
CarlOmaha
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Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 03:42 AM UTC
I've done some additional build up of LIquitex on the bow wave and stern wake. The "rolls" of the stern wake may be difficult to see because of the "all white" effect and the lighting and the camera.

Is this what you were looking to see, Rui?







skipper
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Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 04:24 AM UTC
Hi Carl

Sorry for the late comment - the Akula dio is eating all my time
You have accomplished a very convincing effect with this technique, especially the form of the wakes. Only need to take a little care on the rounded areas (wake)... perhaps you can sculpt it while it dries?
One thing that I think that you have space to improve is the coloring of it... (I know, I know... we have talked about this a million times )
You should try some wet on wet painting, blending the colors so that you don't have only white and blue.
Since this is an experiment/test bed you should give it a try.
Look at pictures from above (or sometimes even from decks towards other vessels) and see how the sea color changes and blends in a not so linear way... splotches, twirls and foam can make a very interesting representation of an ordinary scene, just a ship sailing.

You are on the right course! Steady as she goes!
Rui

CarlOmaha
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Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 04:51 AM UTC
What delay? I just posted these latest pics!

If you have a real example of the "rounded area" I think I need a reference to be sure I know what you're saying. Maybe you're saying to extend the rolling wake at the stern, a little farther behind the boat.

As always, I will keep in mind what say about the different colors/shades/hues and wet-on-wet mixing.

I tried a little of this on the bow of my USS Sampson DDG-102, but nowhere else on it.

Thanks for your observations and comments, Rui. That's why I'm posting my experiments, here.


Quoted Text

Hi Carl

Sorry for the late comment - the Akula dio is eating all my time
You have accomplished a very convincing effect with this technique, especially the form of the wakes. Only need to take a little care on the rounded areas (wake)... perhaps you can sculpt it while it dries?
One thing that I think that you have space to improve is the coloring of it... (I know, I know... we have talked about this a million times )
You should try some wet on wet painting, blending the colors so that you don't have only white and blue.
Since this is an experiment/test bed you should give it a try.
Look at pictures from above (or sometimes even from decks towards other vessels) and see how the sea color changes and blends in a not so linear way... splotches, twirls and foam can make a very interesting representation of an ordinary scene, just a ship sailing.

You are on the right course! Steady as she goes!
Rui


skipper
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Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 05:33 AM UTC
Hi Carl

Disregard the delay comment - I am too tired

The rounded area I mention is this (blue circle area):


The wet-on-wet technique, with some practice, can make things like this:

Tug... on the Akula Dio


NRP Diogo Cão


USS Cassin

Two notes:
1 -I am not saying I master this technique, but I think I can make convincing troubled water areas (I think...)
2 - Sorry for the poor photo quality... just trying to make my point with images, while on a Akula Dio break (to breathe, drink more coffee and relax a bit!)

Rui
CarlOmaha
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Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 06:15 AM UTC
"Convincing", that's the key, isn't it? Your water effects are most convincing.

Here, I have added some Teal and US Navy Blue Gray to make some "foaming" effects. I took these pics, in the natural light, outside. I hope you can tell the difference.

Thanks for the clarification on the "rounded" areas.



goldenpony
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Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 06:29 AM UTC
I have sort of missed most of this discussion, until now.

Gee, this is just what I was looking for. I am going to have to replan my dio for the Divine Waterline Campaign.


skipper
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Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 06:34 AM UTC
Hi Carl

Yes, there are subtle color changes, but I think I have found "your problem".
Don't be afraid to paint the white of the Liquitex!
When I make "my" wakes, I kept on adding white with the blue/greens and only use pure white after the first coat of gloss varnish. It will add (again, I like to think so!) some depth created by the previously color mixes.

I hope this helps you, Carl (and the other readers who are willing to try this)


Rui
CarlOmaha
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Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 06:49 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi Carl

Yes, there are subtle color changes, but I think I have found "your problem".
Don't be afraid to paint the white of the Liquitex!
When I make "my" wakes, I kept on adding white with the blue/greens and only use pure white after the first coat of gloss varnish. It will add (again, I like to think so!) some depth created by the previously color mixes.

I hope this helps you, Carl (and the other readers who are willing to try this)


Rui



Rui,
When you say "paint the white of the Liquitex" do you mean to paint it while it is wet and white? And use the blue/gray/green colors at that time? Thus, tinting the wet Liquitex, I would think.

I understand (and it was too, late here) about painting the darker colors first and finishing off with the white at the end. And you must be using enamels or artist's oil, right? I'm using acrylics by Testors, here. That makes a difference in techniques, too. My acrylics are drying too, quickly for a "wet-on-wet" technique.

JIm,

What aspects of this experiment or discussion are you finding to be beneficial, exactly?
skipper
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Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 07:06 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi Carl


Rui,
When you say "paint the white of the Liquitex" do you mean to paint it while it is wet and white? And use the blue/gray/green colors at that time? Thus, tinting the wet Liquitex, I would think.



Carl,
For me, Liquitex would serve as a "texture maker". Once the wave is made and dry, I would treat it as if it was just watercolor paper.


Quoted Text


I understand (and it was too, late here) about painting the darker colors first and finishing off with the white at the end. And you must be using enamels or artist's oil, right? I'm using acrylics by Testors, here. That makes a difference in techniques, too. My acrylics are drying too, quickly for a "wet-on-wet" technique.



Yes, you're absolutely right! From darker to lighter... But the use of pure white, directly from the paint jar (undiluted) will cover the darker colors. Actually, all the examples I have shown here are painted with Vallejo (Model Color) and Andrea acrylic paints.
They dry pretty fast, but passing with a damp brush (very slightly, because if it is too wet, it will wipe/ruin the effect) I can persuade the paint to dry a little bit slower.
Also, as you see on the Tug from the Akula dio, the whitish areas were painted after the main greenish turbulence have dried.
A almost wash of white was applied carefully with a 000 brush. After dry, applied the first coat of gloss varnish, and only then the pure white.
At this moment another coat of gloss is missing.

Hope this helps
Rui
CarlOmaha
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Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 07:10 AM UTC
I don't know if you can tell, in these pics, but I have covered most of the green with dark sea blue and created a pleasing effect, I think.





Here is a note about the Plastruct "agitated water" sheet. It is possible to paint it too, much (even with air brush) to where you minimize the texture of it. The PT Boat experiment piece has been painted with spray can enamel, too, and it has become more smooth than the original piece.

Yesterday, I experimented with adding distilled water to the Liquitex gel to make it flow easier so that it can be poored onto the surface. This works pretty well. I used a 1:1 ratio and the water stays mixed up, but when it is stirred, some lumps remain. Shaking it in a covered container works to mix it well, but it must be allowed to settle, otherwise there are a lot air bubbles when it dries and it dries frosty instead of clear.

I've taken this and poored it onto a piece Tamiya OEP and it reduces the texture of that ocean effect, pretty well, but it might take a couple of applications.

Photos of this experiement wouldn't show the effect of this technique very well.

I've even applied thick Liquitex to a surface and blew it with low pressure air, about 40 - 100psi. This makes some cool waves, but the Liquitex doesn't blow evenly as it dries. This blowing method makes for nicer waves than touching the thick LIquitex with anything solid.
skipper
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Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 07:14 AM UTC
Hi Carl

Actually, I prefer this last color and effect on the Agitated Water Plate.
It has (for my own taste!) a much more convincing shade and the effect with the blue over the previously applied green makes a very interesting scene

Don't miss my above answer to your previously made questions
Cheers,
Rui
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