1/144 Revell Fletcher Class Destroyer Build (Early)

I have already given an “In box” review of this kit, so I won’t go into the details of the ship nor the kit. Suffice to say that the kit is an early round bridge Fletcher so the choices are somewhat limited. The exact ship, I don’t know just yet. I would love to do a post war Fletcher………but that’s for a different time.

The Review is on MSW:
http://modelshipwrights.kitmaker.net/review/3836

Also, this is the FIRST ship I have done since I was a kid and that was many moons ago. Have done a "few" helicopters and WWII planes. Here is my basic plan:

1. I want to work on my “oil canning” techniques.
2. I want to scratch build most of the Hull openings, such as the Condenser Intakes and Discharges.
3. I am waiting for a company to do a comprehensive PE set for the Fletcher as the kit is good, but basic.
4. I want to open most of the hatches.
5. Working on other ideas.
6. This might take 6-8 months.

I have already been doing my research on the basic ship and posted some photos of my first iteration of the hull “oil canning”. I’ll just bring those photos along to get this thread started.

I’ve been taking photos of my work in progress for a while now as the hi-res photos show all the flaws better than my eyes can pick them out. They are sometimes very scary.

As always, comments and suggestions are welcomed.

Here is a shot of the “New” hull



I did testing before I cut into the kit.



Research and Marking the hull to be “modified”



Cutting



Each individual square sanded, polished, and the primed. Those squares are awfully small and the polishing would not standup to a bare metal finish but I think will do nicely under primer and paint.



Just a note about the sanding process. I found that if I sanded it all at one time, I wore down the edges of each square and did not get INTO the bottom of the square. That required going back and scraping more. It was just a bit of a pain (and time consuming).

Now comes the stern.

Regards
Steve

Looking very good Steve.

Í'm very impressed with the "oil-canning" Steve. Not sure if I'm "brave" enough to try that myself (bought the Revell Fletcher last week and am still building the Italeri S-100).
Revell list a lot of custom paint mixes for the cammo paint scheme for the Fletcher (measure 42??). Do you have a list of the FS numbers used or is there a company that sells ready mixed colours for the Fletcher?
cheers,
Julian

Julian,

You only have to be brave for the first scrape. At that point your commited to getting it right no matter what. For me, there was just too much flat space that needed character.

Paints? US Navy had strange numbering for their paints. Here is the bible for US Navy paint. ShipCamoflage Here is another site: http://www.researcheratlarge.com/Ships/S19-7/index.html

I studied the different websites, figured out the the Navy colors i need for the scheme I would use, and ordered mine from White Ensign Models. Correct name, correct color.

Regards
Steve

Thank you very much Steve. This will put me in the right direction.
Yeah, you are right, it's only the first cut that puts youn the road to weeks of scraping.
Would a Dremel have been an option? I used one to open all the flood holes and vents on my Revell U-boat and that went okay (is a completely different operation i know). Use one of those nasty pink grinding spheres at a very low speed ?
Julian

Hey Julian

In my humble opinion doing these "squares" in a mass production... aka dremel won't work. At least it didn't work for me....its too fast. Now maybe one that you can slow it down to almost nothing.......AND be able to attach some sort of SMALL very fine grit roundish attachment. What I personally found was that I had to work each individual "square". I even made an aluminum can template to protect the ridges. My most effective tool was a pencil eraser with a small piece of 2000 grit wet sandpaper wrapped around it. I even sharpened the eraser some.

Try it on a piece of scrap styrene. I tested and tested and tested, and tested some more until I felt as though i MIGHT be able to do it without messing up the hull. Test your dremel, it might work for you.

Regards
Steve

wow Steve ...VERY cool hull detailing ...I tip my hat to you

If they put "Measure 12" on their instructions then it's a typo; the Navy never went above Measure 33.

The Federal Standard (FS) system was a post-war creation so there is no DIRECT correlation to the Navy paints and FS paints, but you might find some that look close to you. I prefer to use White Ensign Colourcoat paints, which are formulated to match. You can buy them from White Ensign Direct, or from ShipCamouflage.Com, a site mentioned above that has the ship camouflage database and other good information.
http://www.whiteensignmodels.com/
http://www.shipcamouflage.com/

Doh,................. Sorry, the measure 42 was my typo.
I'll try the dremel on some scrap first when I get around to building the Fletcher.
Will finish my S-100 first. Good luck with the rest of the "canning" Steve, I'll be following your build.
regards,
Julian

Port side polished and primed. Yes, there are a few rough spots that need some attention. The benefit of hi-res photos.........scarey. Remember that hull is only 2 1/2 inches high.



The two bow sections represent over 1000 squares.

Digging into the stern now.

Regards
Steve

That's very nice Steve. I may have to try this with my LCM(3)!

Kenny

Kenny,

Absolutely you need to try it for the LCM. It's big enough and they were not treated as a precious object when moving them around. Beat and battered is the word.

Regards
Steve

Working on the stern now. A little more complicated here than I first thought with the different planes you have to work in. The stern itself was easy, it's the belly wrapping up the sides and the turn back to the stern that's working me over. Lots of exacting lines having been drawn.

Pics to come shortly.

Pre-ordered the upcoming Nautilus Models PE set for the ship. I know i saw a turned brass mast somewhere.

Regards
Steve

Hi there Steve,
Maybe a stupid question but I understand that "tin-canning"is caused by the long term effect of sailing at speed against the sea causing the plating between the frames to be pushed slightly inwards, Surely the the effect would be more pronounced at the forward part of the vessel than towards the stern (or am I missing something fundamental about destroyers here ?)
cheers,
Julian

Hey Julian,

No, you are correct, but don't forget the "Wharf Rash". Tug boats etc banging into the bow and stern areas jockying the thing around. Just banging into the fenders tends to bend metal. Even the welding process heats and cools the steel causing some buckling.

These photos, though they reflect ships that are over 60 years old do represent some of the wharf abuse.





Threw in a modern day example also.



Regards
Steve

I stand corrected Steve, the pictures tell a convincing story.
Cheers,
Julian

P.s. I have had contact with Revell of Germany asking if it's possible to buy or beg a spare set of hull halves so that I can be a bit more free experimenting with the dremel theorie I mentioned. Have only a confirmation of reciept but no answer to the question just yet.

Julian,

I used both upper and lower 1/32 scale A-10 wings to do my "practice" on. Even the inside. Once i felt comfortable with my "technique", I felt i was ready to play. I've done this on aircraft in the past but that mostly isn't oil canning, but a "stressed skin" effect from the deformation from the riveting process. So this was new to me.

I had to make my own sanding sticks (seen in one of the pics above) so as to smooth the inside without sanding down the outer edges........which are the frames and stringers. That for me was and is still my biggest headache. The squares are just so small.

You can still "measure and mark" the hull, even if you don't decide to scrape. I used a "permanent" marker that erased well with alcohal.....not so permanent. So it would still be reversable.

Again......I'm going for the subtle effect. Nothing dramatic. In a flat paint it will be subtle I think. Hopefully just enough to catch the eye.

Good luck on yours.

Regards
Steve

Its a big but rewarding task, looking forward to see some more pics.

Sorry for hijacking, but even brand new wessel, can sport the canning effect:



Cheers/Jan

I believe the 'oil canning' effect is also caused by thermostatic contraction of the sheet metal comprising the hull's shell plating. As the steel gets colder, it contracts, eventually bowing inward where it is not backed up by structure like frames and strakes. So, depending on the outside temperature, the same hull can show more ribbing or less.

For modelers, this can be a factor in realistic depictions of operations in arctic or even North Atlantic scenes, as well as wharf rash.

--Karl

Karl,

You are most probably correct.......but i'll wager the tug boat out dimples the temperature.

Two effects here........."oil canning" and then "stressed skin". From my observations, the oil canning is caused by pressure (water, explosives, and or strong objects....tugboat or wharf) on the thin steel skin. Stressed skin might more rightly fall under temperature fluctuations.....or....from deformation of the steel skin from rivets or welding, (as in new construction).

Whatever the effects in play here..........I've just studied my photos and "gone for it". After the first cut.....there is no turning back. Once I get my "first pass" done, I'll see if I need more.

Karl.....I also see quite a bit of oil canning on your museum also......

Regards
Steve

Regards

Hi Steve!

Sure, the effect is commonplace on metal vessels. Your work on the issue is truly remarkable. For my part, I frequently model combat damage and ofttimes if dimpling is necessary, I would employ a malleable product like foil pressed carefully over a plastic armature to represent the ship's inner structure.

That process, however, is only practical for local applications, producing an entire hull that way would be difficult. Using the careful scraping methodology you've demonstrated, in spite of its tedious nature, is probably the best way to pull off the effect.

--Karl

Not a big change in temperature for this one. Not in south Louisiana anyway.

Gator.............well how about this one: So dramatic that it looks like a whole rack of charges went off as she was passing. But you certainly can see every dimple and ding.



I'm looking for subtle. And i certainly do need to visit this ship.......in late summer when the river is down.

Regards
Steve

Hey, I heard you had snow in 'Nawlins last autumn (or the beginning of this year), that must be a hefty temperature difference?
Julian

OK, I'm back.

Getting the stern “oil canned”.

This area turned out harder that I had thought it would be. Must have been all the corners and rounded surfaces. It wasn’t like an artist’s canvas to work on as the bow was. This took work and rework.

What you see here is the stern having been:
1. Measured and marked
2. Scraped
3. Sanded (1000 grit wet dry)
4. Polished (2000, 3600, 6000, 12000 grit)
5. Then remarked and scraped after errors found.
6. Sanded and polished again.
7. This went on for some time.
8. Cleaning and priming with Mr Surfacer 1000 hid a lot of those scrape/sand marks.

I put “some” oil canning on the stern’s belly. What I was trying for here was just to give that glassy smooth belly some relief. I will do the same with the rest of the “belly”.

Some build notes:
1. I found that I was a bit too timid scraping. I took too little off. That required several re-dos in scraping. Even though I was looking for a subtle finish………..I needed to dig deeper. Third try and I got it done.
2. My references are of ships that are over 60 years old and have received more than their fair share of tugboat rash. I used them as references but did not want to did THAT deep.
3. It is very hard (for me at least) to get the insides of those scraped out squares sanded and polished. I have been trying to get them as polished as I would for a "bare metal finish" and it just wasn't getting done. Primer did well and a topcoat will make me happy i believe.

Scraped:


Scraped, sanded, polished, and primed:






What I have done is 1/4 of the forward section and 1/4 of the stern. I will not do the sides. I will put some relief on the belly.

Regards
Steve