What is it about Warships that turns your key ?
For me it is the history, WW-2 in general. At the beginning the Battleship was the simbel of power among the nations. Majestic, powerful giants! They cought my eye when I was a lad, and they still do! But also for me it is the gracefulness, they please my eye's!
There is nothing like the site of a Warship plowing through the waves on the open sea. To me it is a picture of beauty and power to behold!
The Battleship is my favorite. I think becouse they are a thing of the past, a part of history that I want to keep alive through my modeling.
So what is it about warships that make you want to model them ?

Cheers mate's,
Garry

I agree with what you've said. Ships in general, and warships in particular, are the greatest combination of size, power, and beauty ever created. I haven't made nearly as many as I'd like, but nothing looks better sitting by itself on a shelf or desk than a well made ship model.

Can't agree more with the reasons Gary and Rodger said, but I will also add. It is not only the history of these beauties. They are a rare breed that once ruled the open seas. For me it is when I go visit one. I.E USS North Carolina(which I am lucky enough to have an hour away from where I live) or The Massachusetts (2hours from where I grew up from). Driving up to it and seeing the size and power sitting in front of you is awe inspiring, but it is when you are able to walk on the decks of these great engineering marvals that really does it. Hearing the stories and seeing the workings of these ships that drives home the desire to build one and have it on the shelf.
If anyone can get a chance to go to one don't pass it up. You will walk away a different person with a different perspective on them.
Paul

: personally i prefer any warship, as long they are 1:700 scale, until i have enough of that scale, i will proceed to another. What i like about warships, they impressed me with that majestic view of their structure especially aircraft carriers. i just love carriers. building warship give a sense of satisfaction, imagine you can own your "own" Pacific Fleet" or the Black Sea Fleet etc. When you are building all this ships, you actually increase your knowledge about the historical past. You came to know how the ship's name came about etc. I have few words who missed modeling ships : ---They are much more impressive than any other models when you complete the whole fleet----

Interesting point of view garrybeebe. I think that a beautifull ship of WW2 will look very nice in my shelf. I have a place to put one.
I´m an armor and AC modeler that returned to the game about 5 years ago (I´m 51) and I think I has the patience and the necesary skills (I believe) to give a try to a ship.
What ship would you recomend me thinking that it will be my first one ? What scale ? Which brand ? I prefer a WW2 US ship. I will include it in my future projects.

If they are done well, they look great..I tried to make one...but never really enjoyed it like Tanks or Planes tho....

A good starter kit, and one that is recommended by others is the Tamiya 1/350 USS Fletcher class Destroyer. its not overwhelming as a 1/350 Battleship would be, but is a fine kit. With good fit and great detail. They sell for about 25 US dollars.

HTH,
Garry

I build two groups of warships: those named for my hometown and/or home state; and hisrorically significanly important ships. I have three kits of ships named after the State of Tennessee.

Howdy Guys,

Thx should go out to you garrybeebe for posing the question.

For the record, I'm not a ship modeler. Actually, to be more precise. I'm not a modern ship modeler. By that I mean anything made of metal. I have modeled quite a few ships when I was much younger, but they were all sailing ships. Anyway, more to the point.
I have been wanting to indulge in 'modern' ship modeling but have a few questions first. (Hint. Here's where you have the opportunity to lure another modeler into the realm of Warship modeling.
Now, I really don't want to make anyone angry, or alienate anyone to my honest inquiries. So, here it goes.
First off, (and I'm making the decision at this point to NOT go into the crazy availability of two hundred different scales.... ), why would someone prefer 1/700th scale?? Now, my question is an honest one. I am used to a scale (whether AC or Armour) where you can recreate a certain amount of significant detail that is apparent to the normal naked eye. (it's here where I really don't want to hear stories of how Mr. such-and-such built an exact replica of the U.S.S. New Jersey on the head of a pin ). So, I suppose, speaking entirely from a unlearned persons POV, that 1/700th scale is based on 'more for the money'? In other words, you can have almost an entire PAC fleet for under $100.? Actually, that's not fair, I've seen some of those 'Waterline' kits going for MUCH more.......so, more so, why?
Continuing.
Looking from the outside 'in', it seems to me that 1/350th scale is a little closer to actually creating some 'detail' on the ship structure itself. And companies like Trumpeter apparently feel the same way. After all, the 'kit of the year' is a Trumpeter 1/350th scale ship.....correct?
So, expanding even further. Is the whole ship scale ' thing' , simply a matter of the size of the box? Or more to the point, is it simply a matter of the amount of styrene in the box?
Being a large scale aficionado, the larger the scale the better. I'm presently building a 1/144th scale submarine and find it just dandy. Wish there were more.
I suppose it all breaks down to how much 'shelf' space we all realistically have doesn't it?

Seriously though, I would like some input on this so I can 'sort it all out'. My desire is to embrace model ship building, but find it hard to get by the 'scale' thing. With any luck, the wonderful Warship modelers we have here at Armorama can help me understand it all.......
Help!


Tread.

Anyone know where I can get a 1/350th scale Typhoon Class sub, or an Ohio Class?.......O.K., just kidding.

Greetings Tread !
For me and I suppose a lot of other ship builders, it is the availability of ship kits. In 1/700 scale you can build the entire Japanese fleet ! And most of the other Navy's. And that is what makes the 700's so popular. Now I am talking Ijected plastic kits here. In 1/350 scale you have maybe 20 different ships to choose from, same with 1/400 scale. Most modelers want to build more than just 20 ships, so there is where the 1/700's come in.
Like you mentioned, larger scales offer more chances to add alot of detail. And thats where I am at right now. I have built around 75 1/700 kits, now I am Just building in 1/350 and 1/400 scale. I can scratch build parts and add PE sets to this scale, where in the 1/700's I never did use PE . Fat fingers and old eye's!
Dang if I had a warehouse I would be building in 1/196 scale! But not, I'm cramped for space and short in the walet.

Hope this helps.........Leading you to the wet side!

Cheers,
Garry

Ship modeling is the best! Don’t get me wrong, I build armor and aircraft also and they’re great too. But, there is something about spending months of your spare time working on something that is as historically unique and technologically marvelous as a warship. I love spending hours and days reading and researching the history of a ship before starting the model; it really helps in gaining a greater appreciation for the considerable manpower and engineering that went into building and sailing the real thing and it helps me to maintain interest throughout the build. I suppose that all of this can be said about planes and tanks, but I think that ships have a far more profound effect on me, personally. I don’t know… maybe spending 12 years in the Navy has something to do with it too… although you would think that I would be sick of ships!
As far as the scale goes, I think a lot of people prefer the 1:700 scale because of the HUGE selection and the smaller amount of shelf space required; however, the kits can be quite challenging because some of the parts are pretty darn small. Also, some of the Tamiya kits cost as much as the larger scale kits. I think that I prefer the 1:350 scale because they show a little more detail (still look good even without PE) and I can still clearly see the model on the shelf from across the room without having to squint (my eyes are getting old), and yet they aren’t so big that they take up ALL of my shelf space. One could argue that there are just not enough subjects in 1:350 but I look at it this way: if it takes me approximately six months to complete a 1:350 scale model, and there are about 30 injection molded kits available on the market, then that’s 15 years of modeling in 1:350! And that does not include the aftermarket kits for converting some of these into other ships of the same class (another 5 years)… or resin kits (another 15 years)… or, or, or scratch building (another lifetime)! AAHHHRRGG!! To many kits, not enough time!!

Happy Modeling!

Todd

lol, lol, lol....many thx for the chuckle foxroe, and Many thanks for your kind input garrybeebe!

All of what you said makes sense. So, please bear with me for a few minutes, while I bring up some more points I'd like input on. And please, understand that I mean well with my queries...O.K?

First, WHY O WHY are their sooooooooooooooooooooooooo (did I say so? ), many different scales in ship modeling???? I sense the answer is quite deep, huh?
Next, an observation. In 1/700th scale, from about 10 feet away, I can't tell the difference between one Destroyer or another, or one Battleship and another.....heck, it's tough to tell the U.S. boats from the Japanese boats.... Also (while I'm testing you guy's patience with noob's), are you trying to tell me that it takes approx. six months to build a 1/700th scale ship? Now, (again, I mean well :-) ), I can see six months super-detailing a 1/350th scale Aircraft Carrier, but a 1/700th scale?.....really?
There's more.
foxroe mentioned that " ...some of the (1/700th scale) Tamiya kits cost as much as the larger (1/350th) scale kits"...............why? Because they can?
Still more.
Why are some of the 'waterline' style kits more expensive than the full hull ship? I mean, they're missing a substantial part of the lowel hull/screws/etc aren't they? One would think (those of us on the outside) that that type of packaged kit represents less in material, R&D, packaging, initial pattern making, and mould making......wouldn't it?

O.K., I'll stop there for fear of making you guys mad. But I am speaking from a friendly heart here, and am truly curious.
Your input is considered priceless, and helps me understand the whole thing tremendously.

Thx,

Tread.

Oh, BTW. I really don't think these old eyes(meaning mine), could possibly embrace 1/700th scale, so it's got to be 1/350th or larger for the TreadMeister!!

Ok Tread, here goes! My insight into the multitude of ship scale is that they all started in different countries. 1/700 Japan, 1/600 England, 1/500 thru 1/426 USA, 1/400 france(Europe for that matter) , 1/350 USA? , !/200 and 1/196 ???
You get my drift! No company wants to generalize in a constant scale. That means they would have to spend lots of money on machinery and new molds. Although modelers tend to build mostly in 1/700 and 1/350 as popular scales.
!/700"s are definetly up close and personel scale ! About the six month build, I beleave Foxroe was meaning the 1/350 kits.
Some of Tamiya's and Hasegawa new realeases and there deluxe full hull 1/700 kits have prices that aproach Tamiya's 1/350 line. And yes, its because they can. But then again, I'm not buying them ! On the Full hull verses waterline prices. Once again, because they can! The thing I dont understand is some of the cheeper kits are designed so you have a chioce of building the kit full or waterline style. Go figure!
Tread, I'm pleased to answer your questions. Heck thats one of the reasons I am here!
Kind of a trade off here, I have just started building Armor and I love it! And so far I have learned alot on this site.

Cheers mate!

Garry

Hey Tread:
I too build a ship or two once in a while. I got a 1/350 Missouri in the works as we speak. All I can do is echo some of the answers that some already posted. 1/350 scale is a big chunk o plastic (hull is 33 inches). Where as a 1/700 is about 15 inches, these depend on the ship you are building of course. The choice between the scales I would guess depends on the amount of room you have to display, not to mention there is more selection in the 1/700scale.
Upon checking out some reviews of the newer 1/700 releases that are hitting the market. These kits have just as much detail as some of the 1/350 ones do. It is just you may need a telescope to work on them. (At least with my eyes anyway), but with the molds they have and am stuff out there you can really super detail either scale and get the same results in detail.
As for the cost. That is the great mystery of the modelling world. Why does new 1/700 cost as much as a 1/350. The only answer I can come up with is. Most of the Tamiya's 1/350 came out in the 80's. So say a 1/350 New Jersey or Missouri or whichever one you may choose can be gotten for about $45.00, but these kits are about 20 years old. If they were to come out with them today you may be looking at about $125-150 Like Trumpeter's 1/350 kit that you originally mentioned. I believe when it hit the mainstream was going for $120. Tamiya's 1/350 USS Enterprise is still about $120 or so and I believe it is almost a 20year old kit too, but that 160 has come down as of late and can be gotten for about $100-110.
As for the build time depends on a lot of factors. So I will try to break it down for ya. These apply to both 1/700 and 1/350 scales.

Depending on the time you can actually sit and build takes really about 2 months, but six is more realistic.
Takes 2 weeks to get over all the of the pieces and the directions, head scratching and forming a plan on how to attack this thing.
2 weeks of dry fitting parts, and finding all the gaps
2 weeks of sanding and filling. Depending on the fit of course.
2 weeks of what I like to call PE shock. This one hard to explain w/o having a set in front of you.
1 Month of PE bending. (This time includes the cussing, rebending of parts bent wrong, searches in the carpet because at least one part will take flight, they should put that in the instructions).
1 Month of painting and weathering. This also depends on if you have the right colors on hand. How the masking goes, touch ups, and if you are going to put the optional rigging on you ship.
So yeah about Six months sounds about right. All times are an estimate and in no way strict guidlines that must be followed.
Seriously though if you do decide to take one on it will be some of the best time building you will have. Watching that plastic grow into something that once ruled the open ocean will give you a sense of accomplishment that is hard to put into words.
Hope this helps and keep the Questions coming if your asking you are curious and considering it. No anamosity taken here. Only hope that you will decide to give one a try and post pics for all of us to see.
Paul

I think Garrybeebe hit the nail on the head with the scale thing. There must have been some intra-national agreement about what the standard scale should be for ship kits, hence 1:700 in Japan, 1:600 in England, etc. As far as odd scales go, I think companies like Revell were probably limited to one particular mold size initially so their kits couldn’t be any bigger than the mold, but they also made the kits as big as possible so as to maximize the model’s size (regardless of the ACTUAL ship’s size) and thereby maximize their profit (big kit = big money). This is where the phrase “box scale” comes from (I’ve also seen “30cm” scale kits, where they’re all 30cm, regardless of what ship it is!).

Now as far as price goes, I think that Tamiya charges more for their kits in general because the quality of the mold, the detail, and the accuracy of the kits tends to be the best (shy of resin kits). Because of this the demand for them is high, and the laws of Supply-and-demand economics state that an increase in demand results in an increase in cost to control the supply… blah blah, blah blah, blah blah blah blah. Sorry, got carried away there.

Anyway, as far as time goes, it takes me so long to complete a kit because I’m a little limited on time. I have a wife, kid, full time job (plus overtime to make ends meet!), a dog, and a horrible internet addiction. Consequently, I may only spend a few minutes to an hour every night or every other night working on a model. I also like to switch over to other kits in the middle of building a model just to shake things up a bit. So, I can deal with the fact that there are a limited number of 1:350 kits available (35+ years worth!).

Your questions are entirely UNoffensive BTW. I’ve avoided posting on a lot of other ship modeling sites because they tend to be frequented by some rather snobbish people (“What, you don’t use photo-etch in 1:2400? You’re SOOooo yesterday!”) who will scoff at your questions or summarily ignore them (but I’m not bitter), but I think it’s safe to say that the people that post here are genuinely willing to exchange information and help out.

Anyway, it doesn’t really matter what scale you build in or what degree of detail you build to. I’m not a huge stickler for detail, and frankly PE scares the bajeezus out of me (that last post was right... PE shock [shivers]). I prefer accuracy over detail, and gosh darn it, I just want it to look good!. The point is, as long as your having fun, it doesn’t really matter. It IS a hobby after all!

Whew! [cracks knuckles and vigorously shakes hands to restore circulation to fingertips]

Don't get me wrong, I love tanks. Gerw up with them , served in them. Love the smell of diesel and the crack of the main gun going off.......but.......there is something about the majesty of one of the modern era battleships, the Yamato, the Bismarck, the Iowa class. The sheer immenseness of the Carriers. At the moment, I've got 1 carrier and 4 battlewagons built. Plan to get the KG5 soon and the Nimitz when it is released. Heard rumors of an NC class and Indiana class coming out as well.

Howdy Fellas,

Wow............... :-) You guys are the best! It's good to know that the 'Warship Guys' on the site are as superbly understanding and helpful as the Armour side of the site............Good stuff.

Ya know, one of the guys down at my local Dollar/Styrene Exchange (read, hobby shop ), has been trying to get me to build ship models for literally years! He's a good man, and usually quite helpful and informative. And, to be honest, I have really kind of off-handedly avoided ship modeling because of the things we just discussed here. But you guys, in just a couple of days, have pushed me 'over the edge'! I am going to give this whole 'Warship' thingie a try! But, you have only yourselves to blame for it! #:-) LOL,.....You laugh now, but when you see my first ship after all these years, sporting welded on track plates for added protection, and painted three-tone german 'assault' camoflage, you'll regret what you started here today! #:-) #:-) #:-)

Seriously though, I've always been a big fan of the larger scale's (hence all my queries about scale), and would like to do something rather large. I've already got a Chinese missle sub on the desk, (it's in 144th scale), but want to build something bigger. Really like the idea of a Carrier, but a Battleship......now that's tempting. Do they make a 1/350th Yamato? Didn't that sport 18 inch guns?
Since you guys have been sooooooo kind to allow me to 'pick your brains' on all this other 'picky' stuff, how about letting me plumb your heads for some input on what would be a really good boat to build?

Tread.

Oops, sorry, wrong emoticon......just kidding.

P.S.
How about the New Jersey?
the Missouri?
a modern Destroyer?
a 'Pibber'?
a Roman galley?
a sampan?
an ice breaker?
that super secret Navy ship in the Bond movie?
Oooooh, how about that new Australian catamaran designed military transport ship?
I know, the Batboat?
wait, an E-boat? nah, too early in the alpahbet....
how about a PT-boat? But then the alphabet plays a constant role doesn't it?
O.K......How about the U.S.S?
the H.M.S.....too pompous,
an SSBN?
or Russian,
the ....................................

O.K., ...I'll stop. #:-)

Hey Tread, I'm building the Tamiya 1/350 Yamoto right now. Hey this is one great kit! And big! This has very nice detail and the fit is great with very little cleanup. I drilled out the 18 inch barrels so they look very realistic and awesome! The only other kit that compares to this one is the Nachimo 1/200 scale Yamoto, BIG about 5 feet long! But not nearly as nice a kit as the Tamiya Yamoto . I'm building mine in a group build at the Model Fleet site, it is about 60 % finished. See my selected link, I have pic's of it there. Glad you desided to give these floaty things a try! For me they go right along with Armor, I love them both!
Feel free to ask me questions any time.

Regards,
Garry

Ok tread here ya go It not a good pic but this is the Tamiya 1/350 New Jersey Straight OOB. This chunk is only 33 inches long and touching on the Armor side of you has Three yes Three Turrets as to most Battleships Hope this puts you a little more over the edge and gets you glueing and building one.

[img]http://photos.kitmaker.net/data/500/1930Fleet_and_Air_Cover_020.jpg[img]

[img]http://photos.kitmaker.net/data/500/1930Fleet_and_Air_Cover_024.jpg[img]


Hope this Helps
Paul

p.s if the links don't work just click on my gallery to see her

ok one more try at the pics:







last try hope it works this time

Paul

Howdy Guys,

Thx for the replies.

I like the idea of the Yamato, big ship, big Guns! Curious, how much is the Tammy kit? And how much would the Nachimo kit ring up at? 1/200 is almost twice the size, so it's got to be quite a few sheckles...

I also like the idea of the New Jersey. An American boat, maybe a little more familiar....I don't know. But (and here's where I try to sound knowledgable ), didn't the New Jersey have a massive refit? So would there then be two different versions of the kit, or is there an aftermarket conversion set available for the 'modernized' version? Also, didn't they put (I'm going to try to do it again) torpedo bulge's(?) on the sides of the hull? Or was that before the refit?
Also, garrybeebe. I tried to see pics of the Yamato on your site, but apparently my synapse's aren't firing properly. I couldn't find it. But I did find quite a few other photos....good stuff. Your 'club' apparently is a pretty busy group of 'swabbies'....oops, that isn't derogitory is it? Being an old Marine, I suppose I could come up with quite a few names for saliors! #:-) 'Swabbie' being the most endearing from my standpoint...hehe.
Also, I noticed that the Yamato is a whole club project....does that mean it would take me a lifetime to build? One of the reasons I ask is because, remember that hobby shop guy I mentioned in my previous post? Well, I'd like to really surprise him by showing him my completed ship model when it's done. Believe me, it will blow his socks off! (not my work, just the fact that I built a boat!). He's even President of the local 'Model Ship Builders' Cooperative or some such here in Denver. They have a 'store' at a local mall where they display their built ships, and also to try and promote the activity of RC boating.
Sorry, got off on a tangent.
How long do you think it would take me to build either ship?
Also, any more suggestions?

Tread.

P.S. If I start building one of these 'floaty' thingies, you guys have to promise not to laugh too loud at my efforts........O.K.?
Maybe I should start with a 'Pibber'.......

Tread, yes the New Jersey did go through a pretty sizeable refit in the late 60s, early 70s. My Dad got to take me down to the Todd shipyard in Long Beach CA to see her getting refitted. Mostly they added electronics gear and removed light AA, I believe. As built she had torpedo bulges. You might be thinking of the WWI era battleships that were refitted between the wars. In most cases they got torpedo bulges added.

Since you're up in Denver have you every heard of The Colorado Crew? They are a group of RC ship modelers who have quite a collection of pretty big models. One guy has a 1/72 scale USS COLORADO. The thing must be close to ten feet long. Check out their site at www.thecoloradocrew.org I've never seen them in person but one day, with a more reliable car, I hope to get up there and see them.

Hey Tread:
Roger hit the nail on the head about the refits. I think what Tamiya did and someone who knows mor eabout this than me ca confirm was.
They put two kits out. One was the New Jersey and the other was the Missouri. New Jersey version was Modern version and the Missouri was the WWII version. So say if you wanted a WWII New Jersey you would use the Missouri and make the minor changes needed like the bow numbers and such and vice versa for the modern Missouri.
Below is a link to an online shop that has the kits you were referring. It has some Tech info about the kits and it is also the lowest price w/o shipping and handling

http://www.plastic-models.com/listings/main_ventam.html

Hope this helps ya out in some way.
Paul

P.S as for the lauging.. I would never laugh at the attempt of a ship, but with you and also cry too as I did alot of both while doing mine... #:-)

Yo Tread, the Tamiya Yamoto goes for 51 bucks at greatmodels, the 1/200 Nachimo Yamoto goes for 446 bucks at the same place. They did'nt say but I think the Nachimo must be gold plated, sheesh! Nope the Tamiya kit gets my vote!
If you were thinking about one of the Tamiya 1/350 Iowa class kits, the Mighty Mo is WW-2 fitted and the New Jresey Is a modern fit, your choice!
Hey we are Swabbies! But I call myself the old salty dog ! My Yamoto pic's are in the Yamoto group build forum.
Realy Tread, It should not take you that long to build the Yamoto. I am useing the WEM's Pe set on mine, that takes longer then building the whole kit! I build the 1/350 Tirpitz in my gallery in 2 months, and I like the way it turned out.
And Tread, I will not laugh unless you tell a good joke ! Hey with these Tamiya kits you cant go wrong !

Cheers,
Garry

Howdy swabbies,

To HalfYank: I'm both jealous for your visit to the shipyards, and for having such a great dad who would take you there! Good on ya mate! :-) And Thx for the info regarding the New Jersey. I stopped and did a little 'research' on my home from work today (so I would be a wee bit more prepared for you guys) and found out pretty much trhe same thing. I must say, either ship (the N.J. or the Mo.) certainly looks more impressive in it's WW II clothes! All that AA armament is staggering! Hard to imagine anything getting through that many guns trained on you...sheeeesh!
Being an old helo driver I also like the refitted version as well. The ship (in general) looks much less cluttered, but it's hard to get past all those GUNS!!!!!!!!!

To warlock: Your explanation supports what I found....many thx. The changing of the bow numbers would be the easiest thing I'd do!
As to your last remark. Somehow I have a feeling I'll make you laugh so hard, you'll cry anyway!! #:-)

To garrybeebe: Thank you very much for checking the 'damage' on the kits...appreciate it. Ya know what? The price of $51.00 for a 1/350th scale Tamiya model kit is superb! I just recently spent $47.95 for a 1/35th scale Tamiya T-55 tank kit! So essentially three dollars more for a kit of that size is a pretty darn good deal!
As to the price tag of, what did you say, $446.00 for a 1/200 scale (approx. 5 foot long?) Yamato Battleship, right? That is about the same quality as Tamiya, correct? Well, I also just recently (about 3 1/2 months ago) purchased the 1/35th scale M1070 Super HET tank transporter model from Accurate Armour for $485.00, so BOTH are looking like pretty good deals to me!
Something to definitely think about........

Tread.

Oh, BTW, I'm a big fan of the character 'Hawkeye' from the TV show 'M.A.S.H.', so jokes are always in my personality......I have just begun 'curbing' them around here so I don't commit any 'frivilous' posting faux paux's.................it 'squeeks' out every now and then anyway... #:-)

I think it's between the Yamoto and the Missouri (really like the WW II setting)......or maybe the Mushashi?